Talk: Ancient Decepticon

UT timeline issues

Maybe I'm missing something since I didn't watch most of the shows involved, but I'm kinda confused by the UT timeline here.

Armada established that the mini-cons left Cybertron and were scattered across Earth 4mya right? (as stated on the Hyperion page). At that point Optimus and Megatron and all the rest were around and fighting over them already right? So how was the Space Bridge project by these forgotten "ancient" transformers only occuring a few hundred years ago? Even assuming that's a typo here how does it work at all even setting it thousands of years ago. My head's starting to hurt. Any help?

(And do I even want to ask where the ancient Combiner Decepticons from energon fit in?)

I'm tempted to strongly suggest the making of a Unicron Trillogy timeline page to cover/organize the major fictional events of that universe. Any support for that? --ZacWilliam 14:27, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

Oh Jesus Lord, that's going to be a mess. We can't even say if the cartoon's Energon takes place 10 or 20 years after Armada because there's two different English versions of the first episode. The comic's version will be easier, I guess. --ItsWalky 17:01, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

I don't think it was ever specified in the cartoon exactly how long ago the four colony ships left Cybertron. Or when exactly the struggle over the pool of super energon that Energon combiners guys were part of before going into stasis was, although maybe the Fan Club Comic has some light to shed on that one?

Is it the DVD version that places Energon 20 years after Armada? That... makes no sense. It would put Kicker in his twenties, based on the flashback to him as kid coming to Cybertron with Rad, Carlos, and Alexis. --KilMichaelMcC 18:16, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

Pretty much. (And, yeah, no dates that I know of for 99% of what happens in the UT.) --ItsWalky 18:25, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

Can't we just say that over the million years, the Transformers on UT Cybertron fought over different things at varying periods of time? Like before the wars, several city-ships left Cybertron intending to construct a Space Bridge network and explore the galaxy (could be tied into the 'explorers' the Armada narrator mentioned in the first ep of Armada).

Then the war started between the 'Bots and 'Cons, and at one point they were fighting over Mini-Cons (which they then got rid of on the Exodus), then they were fighting over Super Energon (which was then locked away with ancient combiner guardians). Sometime during that, a guy named Rodimus leads a band of followers away on some mission or other. And so on.

If we really want to, we can use the excuse that Voicebox really fucked up the dubbing, since they did, all the time. Constantly and without end. And that way we can explain problems with this timeline away. --FFN 18:38, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

You have to be careful, though. The purpose of the wiki isn't to "explain problems away." We shouldn't be drawing any conclusions that aren't already there or implied. --ItsWalky 20:36, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

Then you guys get Aaron or somebody from Hasbro to write these compromised ideas down as an 'official animated storyline for the Unicron Trilogy By Hasbro'. THEN it will be canon :D :P --FFN 04:38, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

Well, technically it'd have to be published by Hasbro, or it's just author intent. So, uh, get someone to make one up for the club magazine at some point. And then we can't put it on the wiki because that's copying an entire feature word-for-word and I'm sure they'd get a bit angry. --ItsWalky 05:28, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

Yeah that's what I meant - somebody official (who knows the animated universe very well) write, somebody official yet non-litigious publish. --FFN 09:29, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

Yeah, some official clarification of all this would be wonderful and the fanclub newsletter's likely the best bet for that. I know, as is, the whole thing is a bit of a mess, but trying to get a grasp on what little WAS established order-wise for the Animated UT, to make these entries work better, can anyone clarify...

• At some very ancient point Omega Supreme defeated Unicron in combat. (Was the timing of this connected to Rodimus or anything else?) After that fight (it must be right?) Unicron disguised himself as one of the moons and settled in to wait in disguise, and created Mini-cons. (Since the point of that was to increase the fighting so Unicron could drain the energy for himself, does that strongly suggest the Bot/Con war was already in progress?)

• At some point (before or after minicons?) bots and cons fought over super-energon. Were any of the cast portrayed as being alive for this or was it ancient "Legend" to them?

• At some point in this Rodimus and co. left to roam the Galaxy. (Were they contemporaries of the main cast or ancient/"historical" figures?)

• Wasn't the Mini-con exodus established as 4 million years ago at the start of Armada? (s' been a while). I know Prime, Megs and all were there in the Comic universe before the MC Exodus, but were they around in the Toon? Leader 1 was Megs old minicon, right? So I'd say yes?

1 million years. --ItsWalky 16:57, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

• And here's the Questions most central to this particular article: The colony ships left long enough ago that they were forgotten legends right? Prime and his crew didn't know of them or know their crew members personally right? Did we get a feel for at what point the ship reached Earth? Humans were around already? Also were the robots that went bad and pretended to be monsters portrayed as being Decepticons THEN or only after Starscream took over in the present day? (Were their confirmed Decepticons, with symbols and all on Velocitron, Gigantion, or the Beast planet before Megs forces came? That would certainly suggest the faction long predated Megatron, as opposed to what the Decepticon entry says right now)

Sorry for all the questions, I just have such a loose hold on all the UT stuff that I'm still trying to figure out how it works to better explain it in the entries here. --ZacWilliam 13:30, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

In my own opinion, I think it should be:

• Early in Cybertron's history, four colony ships left Cybertron to establish the Space Bridge network and to explore the Galaxy. This would tie in with the Armada narrator saying the 'being' (Primus) creating a race to explore and find other lifeforms. And it would would explain why were were off gallivanting around the universe - there was no civil war on Cybertron. No Primus around to influence them later, either, since his spark powered those ships.

• Alpha Q's homeworld is destroyed by Unicron. Alpha Q and Scorponok are imprisoned within Unicron.

• Unicron turned up, and was presumebly considerably weaker than he would later become, and directly challenged the Transformers, as Primus wasn't there to protect them. Omega Supreme defeated him. Unicron decided to try a different approach and bide his time while he gathered his strength, hiding in Cybertron's moon and eventually taking it over completely as he grew (otherwise the TFs would notice there was suddenly a moon in orbit).

• Unicron creates the Mini-Cons, and a civil war breaks out on Cybertron, between the Autobots and Decepticons.

• Fighting over Super Energon, and perhaps later a tempoary truce was signed, where all the remaining Super Energon was locked away, eternally guarded by four Combiners from both Autobot and Decepticon camps. I don't remember why it was locked away exactly.

• Scavenger joins the Autobots and trains a young Optimus Prime in combat.

• Optimus Prime and Megatron became leaders of the Autobots and Decepticons respectively. I don't remember if they were around during the Super Energon wars.

• Wheeljack is assigned to Hot Shot's unit and upon one of their missions together is MIA, presumed killed in action. Hot Shot is later tranferred to Optimus Prime's direct command.

• Rodimus and and his followers leave Cybertron.

• 1 million years ago (and the most recent major event): The war reaches a stalemate, and a truce is signed, with both sides handing over Mini-Cons, storing them on the Exodus. However, Megatron betrays the truce and attacks, hoping to capture all Mini-Cons, while the Autobots defend the Exodus long enough for her to escape.

• Blurr saves Side Swipe from being stuck tied up in rope :P

I would prefer it if the Minicons were established after the Super-Energon war. But that would not explain why the Combiners have Mini-Con ports. But that doesn't explain why Omega Supreme has Mini-Con ports, too. Damn. But then he is never seen using them in any capacity, so perhaps we can ignore it? --FFN 07:00, 16 December 2006 (UTC)

Mini-Cons work with ANYTHING. They don't gotta have PX ports. In Linkage, they were able to powerlinx with Stella Holley's car. --ItsWalky 07:09, 16 December 2006 (UTC)

Megatron clearly wasn't around during the Super Energon conflict. He didn't know anything about it until Unicron guided him to the temple. I think the combiners and Omega Supreme having Mini-Con ports is fairly meaningless, story wise. --KilMichaelMcC 10:52, 16 December 2006 (UTC)

Then we can say the civil war broke out over the Super Energon. After the truce was signed, perhaps peace lasted for awhile, so Unicron creates the minicons for something else for the Transformers to fight over. --FFN 11:51, 16 December 2006 (UTC)

The Gigantion Mini-Cons are canonically Unicron-born as well (Fan Club Soundwave bio). So... --M Sipher 21:05, 16 December 2006 (UTC)

Were they already on Gigantion when the Transformer explorers arrived? --FFN 21:07, 16 December 2006 (UTC)